Mike Gifford, CPWA @FOSDEMHow many organizations? How many people? Still cling to their Twitter / X accounts because they fear giving up the followers they struggled to gain?
How many are there simply because it takes energy to do anything else?
How do we change that?
xnite@mgifford@mastodon.social This may be an #unpopularopinion however Twitter/X seems to be one side of an extreme, and then the generalized community among Mastodon appears to promote the opposing extreme. As long as the platforms are divided there can be no actual productive civil discourse on the matters at hand that divide us as a people. A truly non-bias approach where questions are asked and answers provided without the casting judgement is what is necessary to promote unity among the people of our society. The division between platforms is only mere representation of the actual division among our people. Maybe the solution is to promote and advocate federation among all social platforms and work towards a common goal. To set aside differences and try to understand. In the words of the late great Ozzy "Learn how to love, and forget how to hate".
tyil@xnite@infosec.exchange @mgifford@mastodon.social
the generalized community among Mastodon appears to promote the opposing extremeMaybe if you very explicitly only count #Mastodon instances, but if you mean the #Fediverse instances, you're quite incorrect. The Fediverse hosts a very wide array of opinions, though I would not be surprised if your instance has a sizable blocklist which makes you feel like this is not the case. Hugboxes are quite dangerous, yet some fedi admins, especially Mastodon ones, seem hellbent on ensuring they never ever hear any opinion they disagree with. If you feel like the Fediverse hosts only a particular viewpoint, I would highly suggest joining a better instance.
xnite@tyil@fedi.tyil.nl @mgifford@mastodon.social I am new to my current instance. It seems as if, and I hope I'm correct, that as long as you conduct yourself respectfully then even unpopular opinions are okay.
But the general culture that I've witnessed, in my multiple attempts to adopt the fedi, is that instances have been ready and willing to block entire other instances which do not wish, or see purpose, to moderate particularly "offensive" behaviors. I entirely support the idea that an individual has the control to block people or instances that they don't jive with, but it just feels like it's ignoring the real problem. I feel like people, with clashing opinions, can get a lot more done by communicating and working out their differences rather than condemning and avoiding the discussion all together. We should all be a little more like Daryl Davis who has converted many KKK members away from the Klan through simple human compassion and understanding. https://www.ted.com/talks/daryl_davis_klan_we_talk
tyil@xnite@infosec.exchange @mgifford@mastodon.social
even unpopular opinions are okay.Looking at your instances absolutely humongous list of banned instances, that is definitely not the case.
But the general culture that I've witnessedAs I said in the previous toot, this is most likely to do by the kind of instances you adopt. If you're only sticking to #Mastodon instances with admins that consider it a hate crime to disagree on something, then yes, that will be your experience. I'm unsure as to why, but Mastodon instance admins seem extremely eager to defederate from other instances on a whim.
I entirely support the idea that an individual has the control to block people or instances that they don't jive withI support this too. Individual users can block people they disagree with, because they're only hurting themselves if they create their own hugbox through these actions. Admins doing it for their users is morally wrong. It leads to this situation where you don't even know that most opinions are blocked from your view.
I feel like people, with clashing opinions, can get a lot more done by communicatingDefinitely! If you truly believe in what you typed here, I strongly urge you to either self-host, or find an instance with admins that do not wish to act as fascist dictators to fulfill their own fantasies. In general, I recommend to stay away from #Mastodon instances because it seems the norm there, although there are a few instances with reasonable admins. If at all possible, self-host an instance, so you can be totally sure no insane controlfreaks can ruin your experience. Its also better to have many small instances for the Fediverse in general!
xnite@tyil@fedi.tyil.nl @mgifford@mastodon.social damn ur right. lol. I see a few though I know are just trollfarms tbh. But it does kind of seem to confirm the "in general this seems to be the case".. I've seen a lot of backlash about threads joining federation, and the thought of X even federating if they wanted to. Honestly exactly my issue though. It's like you have to pick sides no matter what.. every instance has this and that instance blocked.. show me one that doesn't block anything but then also doesn't wind up, in itself, getting blocked.
Edit:
Self hosted is pretty good but in past it has been really hard to find/fill my feed. Not to mention the demands on disk space seems to get quite intensive after a while.
tyil@xnite@infosec.exchange @mgifford@mastodon.social
see a few though I know are just trollfarms tbhSure, but should those be immediately defederated completely? Seems like massive overkill to me.
in general this seems to be the caseIf you stick to those instances, then sure. If you do not, like me, you'll see it differently. You choose to stay within that narrative now that you know your current instance is part of the problem.
I've seen a lot of backlash about threads joining federation, and the thought of X even federating if they wanted toI dislike the idea of them federating here, too. The people that come to the #Fediverse do so because they dislike the proprietary platforms and their tactics of manipulation for profit. Getting them here would only lower the quality of discourse on the Fediverse.
you have to pick sides no matter whatYou don't, your admins do it for you without you knowing it.
show me one that doesn't block anything but then also doesn't wind up, in itself, getting blockedThis seems like a weak argument. Any instance I might show you, you can just add to any blocklist at that moment just to ensure you're always right. Besides, getting blocked by incompetent power-hungry #Mastodon admins requires no bad intent on the blockee's part, so it holds no meaning to be blocked in itself.
xnite@tyil@fedi.tyil.nl @mgifford@mastodon.social putting it into that light sure I can see your point. I have certainly had my fair share of instance hopping as well in attempt to find one that fits me. I ran my own at one point, got quite a bit of backlash due to not seeing need to moderate what I consider to be free speech. I do truly wonder how many instances, of the many are blocking so aggressively? it seems that a lot tend to cave under the pressure to moderate "unpopular opinions", at least a couple years ago when I last tried to get into fedi.
Another thing I've failed to see is someone confront a "racist" with actual questions and discourse that lead to further understanding of each other, and possible resolve, rather than leading to personal attacks and threats to "defederate". I certainly understand that some people cannot be reasoned with but I think, much like when I am wrong about something, that many opinions are based on ignorance and lack of understanding. I think that ignorance can absolutely be fixed and resolved just through civil discourse where personal feelings are set aside to create a welcoming atmosphere of actual deeper understanding.
From what I seen X tries to be that but instead of sticking around to try it seems that most people have just left the platform to the point it has become en echo chamber for the ignorant rather than a place for discourse that promotes the change necessary to break our people free from the shackles which divide us.
Mike Gifford, CPWA @FOSDEM@xnite@infosec.exchange @tyil@fedi.tyil.nl I do appreciate you interested in dialog. Very few opinions actually change that way mind you.
Bigger issue is the platform nor those on it. What gets amplified or silenced. There is a clear bias in X that uses free speech as a cover for an anti-woke agenda.
xnite@mgifford@mastodon.social @tyil@fedi.tyil.nl I may be wrong but doesn't that very same platform, X, support free speech both ways? I understand for sure how much it's become a hate machine within itself. I notice it every time that I've logged in over these past couple of years and it's almost as if you can't escape hearing a racial slur or hateful comment against an entire group of people. I absolutely see that as a problem. What I don't see is people combating those views or even trying to create a dialogue of any form of understanding. Very rarely do I see an opposing view. From my perspective those who would disagree the loudest have walked away and left the entire platform one sided. Those who are left get dog piled with none of their own "dogs" to jump in and defend them.
Does true change not come from within? What happens to a society when that society does not speak up against the things that tear them apart from the inside out?
The most important question: Do you ever feel like maybe we are living in that part of history where the future children, who are learning about our time, raise their hand and ask "why didn't anybody do anything to stop them?"